tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post8437492312487840711..comments2024-03-19T09:14:24.926+00:00Comments on RevK<sup>®</sup>'s ramblings: ADR from the other sideRevKhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12369263214193333422noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-79779019510688394192013-11-29T12:19:36.708+00:002013-11-29T12:19:36.708+00:00Rev Adrian
Thanks for agreeing to use of some of ...Rev Adrian<br /><br />Thanks for agreeing to use of some of this material in my efforts to tackle Vodafone over its lack of ACR.<br /><br />Results will be published at http://blog.dntopping.com as-and-when.<br /><br />Thanks<br />DavidDNToppinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04078181921848489023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-16561138076500425262013-11-07T15:01:19.343+00:002013-11-07T15:01:19.343+00:00Well, nobody challenged us :-) arguably the "...Well, nobody challenged us :-) arguably the "hidden number" was not actually part of our service a such. Our service was with our number(s) which did have ACR. It may be that we would have been able to argue out of that, or somehow stop it being routed from normal PSTN and only from our interconnect or some such if pushed. We'd certainly have tried.RevKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12369263214193333422noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-16489508978984809152013-11-07T14:46:45.272+00:002013-11-07T14:46:45.272+00:00Hmm... Well I _was_ going to say: as it looks lik...Hmm... Well I _was_ going to say: as it looks like GiffGaff don't even own and route their own number blocks, I suspect their defence (much the same as yours for the edge case) will be "we don't do it because O2 don't do it"<br /><br />BUT<br /><br />digging a (little) bit deeper, I was a little surprised to discover that they aren't just another MVNO but are appear to be a subsidiary of Telefonica and hence could be argued to have much tighter ties to O2. you might be able to snare O2's non-compliance as a side effect with this!Ionichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06785235601827719311noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-56720229527621574042013-11-06T07:40:36.635+00:002013-11-06T07:40:36.635+00:00That is a perfect case for taking them to ADR I su...That is a perfect case for taking them to ADR I suspect. Try it.RevKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12369263214193333422noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-62787486386351452242013-11-05T23:33:36.219+00:002013-11-05T23:33:36.219+00:00Wow, I am glad someone has found these guys out.
...Wow, I am glad someone has found these guys out.<br /><br />RevK I signed up to giffgaff for my business phone before the summer as its mainly inbound calls giffgaff seemed ideal.<br /><br />As I dont like filtered internet I enquired about removing the parental controls, apparently according to giffgiff they are required by ofcom to require a passport or drivers licence number sent to them over the internet, umm right. So I contacted ofcom who told me its complete nonsense (note this before the PM went public about his anti porn policy and even now its not on ofcom's remit), I asked ofcom do they have an issue with giffgaff making a claim on their website that ofcom are enforcing their policy, and I managed to get ofcom to contact giffgaff about the statement, however ofcom have informed me giffgaff have simply not responded and ofcom seem unwilling to take it further. I have since got a passport (for other reasons) but am not giving them my passport number over the internet and basically giffgaff are lieing to justify a draconian policy. Like yourslef I found them incredibly evasive on tickets they also keep replies very short, just saying things like refer to our "t&c".chrcolukhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01922782032112968876noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-8586814837943787292013-11-05T17:04:11.986+00:002013-11-05T17:04:11.986+00:00Does the ability to ACR apply to the SIM, the serv...Does the ability to ACR apply to the SIM, the service provided, or the specific number?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-13557994847342566522013-11-05T14:29:26.996+00:002013-11-05T14:29:26.996+00:00Well, we did not do it fully as there did not do i...Well, we did not do it fully as there did not do it - if they did, we would. It is, obviously, technically possible. And with lots of notice before the 2003 regs, the mobile networks should have done it, but with a further 10 years, heck they should have done it.RevKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12369263214193333422noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-81920894942998897882013-11-05T14:27:19.419+00:002013-11-05T14:27:19.419+00:00RevK's reply to this got misthreaded below, it...RevK's reply to this got misthreaded below, it seems.<br /><br />There was no real technical limitation involved, it was a decision by Three in how they set up the service A&A were reselling. A&A managed to build a system which was effectively compliant, despite Three not having bothered to comply at the time. Probably because they didn't see enough pressure from customers to comply - let's get working to change that now!jas88https://www.blogger.com/profile/05563592458314214904noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-48393155479108003362013-11-05T14:11:58.347+00:002013-11-05T14:11:58.347+00:00Wow, so even A&A didn't fully implement AC...Wow, so even A&A didn't fully implement ACR due to technical limitations. If a law is impossible to implement due to limitations in current ( at the time ) technology then surely it's a bad law that needs to be repealed Ionichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06785235601827719311noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-87947397557584966632013-11-05T09:55:48.398+00:002013-11-05T09:55:48.398+00:00Their complaints code of practise at http://commun...Their complaints code of practise at http://community.giffgaff.com/t5/Using-giffgaff/Complaints-Code-of-Practice/ta-p/3522825 suggests they use the Ombudsman Services - interesting that the person who told you to talk to Offcom [sic] doesn't appear to have read their own CoP...Alexhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08491808572691231544noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-48786764028487986382013-11-04T22:23:28.299+00:002013-11-04T22:23:28.299+00:00Wow.. how can they run a telco and be so ignorant ...Wow.. how can they run a telco and be so ignorant of the regulations? They could argue the point on ACR, but having no ADR policy in place is the kind of thing Ofcom should come down on them like a tonne of bricks for.<br />Tony Hoylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06485210895681350152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-54128492270908907022013-11-04T20:53:50.115+00:002013-11-04T20:53:50.115+00:00The law says I only have to follow it if I'm f...The law says I only have to follow it if I'm following it.... that's the best interpretation of a law ever. I guess you don't need a law degree to work at GiffGaff support! Don't want to come accros that guy at a red light :-)Brexit factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09499046210014193575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-37081263291824908252013-11-04T20:40:11.449+00:002013-11-04T20:40:11.449+00:00A shame - today was, I think, a new record: a whop...A shame - today was, I think, a new record: a whopping four anonymous spam-callers (so far). All "out of area" as opposed to 'withheld', so wouldn't be blocked by BT's ACR product as I recall, almost as if some greater power wants to encourage me to get Asterisk hooked up to auto-answer them all...<br /><br />iOS 7 does finally allow you to block address book entries - but of course that doesn't cover "out of area" or "blocked" (withheld), so still little use against spammers. Maybe in iOS 7.1, or once 7 is jailbroken...<br /><br />I *think* porting my landline number to A&A VoIP would work, and cease the BT line (and broadband as a side-effect), then I should be able to re-provision it as a broadband-only line at £10. Something to keep in mind for next year when the line rental saver year is up.jas88https://www.blogger.com/profile/05563592458314214904noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-65066907936511507842013-11-04T18:36:41.454+00:002013-11-04T18:36:41.454+00:00Another batty suggestion on how to stop a nuisance...Another batty suggestion on how to stop a nuisance call ringing - "Put the number in your contacts and set it to silent ring tone." - er, yes, but what can I put in that will match a withheld number? The droid who came up with that obviously didn't realise how stupid a suggestion it was until I asked the follow-up question.Phil Reynoldshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07080812032624786351noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-83810848751107422722013-11-04T16:46:35.517+00:002013-11-04T16:46:35.517+00:00I have contacted OFCOM - awaiting their reply.I have contacted OFCOM - awaiting their reply.RevKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12369263214193333422noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-56009791342468630582013-11-04T16:43:40.567+00:002013-11-04T16:43:40.567+00:00Time to contact Ofcom, with a copy of GiffGaff'...Time to contact Ofcom, with a copy of GiffGaff's reply, and ask Ofcom to open an ADR case for you? Could get exciting...Simon Farnsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15190608047563530091noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-92077656986818762892013-11-03T08:08:45.418+00:002013-11-03T08:08:45.418+00:00We did offer ACR, including options to also block ...We did offer ACR, including options to also block unavailable, and options to drop the call with error code or to say why dropped. There was a "hidden" Three number which could be random dialled which would get the phone without getting through us, and we had no ACR on that, but thankfully that was not a problem in practice.RevKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12369263214193333422noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-37007117735216197042013-11-02T22:29:19.019+00:002013-11-02T22:29:19.019+00:00I certainly hope this succeeds, though I have a na...I certainly hope this succeeds, though I have a nasty feeling the arbiter might accept either "in this case, you are both subscriber and user, so 'just press the red button' is acceptable here" or "we don't run the network, O2 don't offer ACR, so we can't provide it" - apart from the voicemail system, their Fujitsu system integrates on the credit-control level, so may not even have the ability to log/block inbound calls as they go through O2.<br /><br />Did A&A offer ACR on those AQL SIMs? (Presumably easy for you, integrating through VOIP so you could route/divert calls, rather than just handling billing.) If so, another reason to mourn their demise - no chance of resurrecting that service any time soon?<br /><br />Depending on your results, I think I may try the same with Three - I switched to them from Giffgaff last year after their censorship fiasco. (For several days, anything they considered "adult" redirected to a 404 on O2's website unless I used a VPN - without consulting or even notifying customers before imposing that nonsense. Three, much more sensibly, provisioned both my accounts as uncensored from the outset.) Of course, since BT get away with charging for ACR, Three might just reply saying "OK, we'll do it for £1,000 setup plus £1,000 per month"...jas88https://www.blogger.com/profile/05563592458314214904noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-78621234679620664452013-11-02T20:56:33.251+00:002013-11-02T20:56:33.251+00:00Once i've finished having the ICO come down on...Once i've finished having the ICO come down on them like a tonne of bricks for refusing to honour a Subject Access Request I might push this with Three again... :)rsmckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01114906505174517753noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3993498847203183398.post-57262327948391588902013-11-02T19:19:55.865+00:002013-11-02T19:19:55.865+00:00Good luck with this! Arguing this point with a cer...Good luck with this! Arguing this point with a certain mobile network got me nowhere years ago - part of my argument was "the phone has already rung by then!". "Choose to refuse" would have been a workable alternative in my case - to block a certain withheld number without me having to know what it is. Whereas I am happy with automated phone-side workarounds, I can see the case for subscriber-controlled refusal.Phil Reynoldshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07080812032624786351noreply@blogger.com