GS1, scam?

You will have noticed codes on products you buy, with a barcode, these are product codes. Also known initially as UPC (Universal Product Codes), and then for Europe, EAN (European Article Numbers), and now GTIN (Global Trade Identification Number).

These are 13 digits (12+checksum), and allocated by a company, GS1.

At the beginning the UPCs were allocated on a one off basis to companies for a one off fee, but this changed and now they are allocated to companies on the basis of an ongoing rental.

Rental makes sense.

It is 12 digits, but this is some whole blocks to each organisation so not evenly spread out, and ultimately they will run out, so a system to manage these makes sense. Rental makes sense on the basis that companies will only rent as many as they need, will be encouraged to recycle from discontinued products, and the whole blocks could be re-allocated to new companies once a company no longer needs them or goes bust, etc. Obviously re-use of codes needs a sensible waiting period, and GS1 even had recommendations on that for companies recycling numbers.

Except!

Things have changed, in that GS1 no longer recommends re-cycling numbers because many platforms stick them to a product and do not update/delete that record.

What is extra odd, when querying this, I found GS1 do not re-allocated lapsed blocks to new companies.

This means GTINs are allocated as a one-off operation to companies - never recycled to new companies and not even expected to be recycled within that company!

So rental is a scam!

Rental for one-off allocation makes no sense. If the allocations really are forever, then the pricing should be for a block to be allocated. Ongoing rental is a scam as if you stop renting the numbers stay allocated. Indeed, discontinued products continue to cost you if rental.

We only have 100, and the price has doubled this year. We do discontinue products, and we tried to recycle (several weeks or Amazon support is failing to do this). So at some point we will be renting a significant number of dead codes, and it will be worth getting a new 100 block, re-allocating new numbers for current products, and stopping rental of the old 100 block.

What is interesting is that platforms like Amazon do seem to lock in a GTIN, but also they seem to not care if it is your GTIN unless there is a conflict. So if Company A got a block of numbers, paid the year, did not use them, and then ceased. Company B could use those numbers on a platform like Amazon as no chance of a clash.

Interestingly GS1 have replied to my various emails right up until I said the above, and they said Company B could face fines. I asked for legal basis for fines. GTINs are not covered by a contract with Company B (not that fines are allowed in a contract). GTINs are not protected by trademark, copyright, or patent or any other legal framework I am aware of. I mean I may have missed something, so I am happy for them to enlighten me - and asked as much - but no reply.

It seems to me, in my honest opinion, a rental arrangement for a permanently allocated resource is a scam, simple as that. If it is permanently allocated it should be a one-off fee for the allocation.

That is just my view, obviously.

Bloody Amazon

Once again, weeks of seller support tickets on Amazon.

The problem - re-use of an EAN - a simple matter.

What is an EAN?

A European Article Number, known now as a Global Trade Item Number (GTIN-13), is a code used on a barcode on a product. They are issued in blocks by GS1. We have a block. We assign to products. UPC (Universal Product code) is the same system.

Reusing an EAN?

When a product is discontinued, there is no reason for that EAN to stay assigned to the discontinued product and so it can be re-used. Or can it?

GS1 did have stuff on re-use of EANs, and time frames for discontinued products before reuse. But apparently now they recognise that platforms assign an EAN more permanently to a product record and they may not be recyclable. So they have changed policy on this!

This is interesting - EAN/UPC used to be assigned for a one-off fee and that was it, but GS1 assign on a rental basis.This year they seem to have doubled the price, even. In theory when you stop the contract, they can assign the block to someone else. But based on this new policy, they cannot - so why do we have a rental? The idea being one could get a block, use it, cease it, but know it can never be re-assigned to keep using for free. Well not quite, there was a contract which continues to say you cannot use once ceased. OK, but a different legal entity could use the codes now, knowing they will never be re-assigned to someone else. Yes, I asked GS1 this. No reply yet.

Basically the idea of GS1 codes being rented only works if they can be reassigned. If they can no longer be reassigned, then rental makes no sense. Also, they will run out with such a policy (which is why rental came in, AFAIK).

Just to be clear, GS1 retain all rights to the numbers they allocate, but I asked, and they could not say, what rights they are! They are not covered by copyright, trademark, patent or any legal framework of which I am aware. They have no rights that I can see apart from contract (which is only with contracting parties).

Amazon

So, Amazon use the EAN barcode, yay. We had a product, with an EAN, sold some, discontinued, and some time later I re-assigned the EAN two a new product. One would expect Amazon to have a process to handle this. It is not an odd thing to do AFAIK.

But I cannot make a new listing, as the description does not match that of the old, deleted, listing.

The issue is the total ineptitude of Amazon seller support...

• Told yes, I am entitled to re-assign an EAN as a GS1 holder (good)
• Told the existing ASIN+EAN cannot be deleted, so tough, so no new listing
• Told the EAN cannot be removed from the existing ASIN, so no new listing
• Told the EAN can be removed from the ASIN, but I have to report a violation (i.e. someone misusing our EAN). So I did that.
• Told eventually (many times over many days) the EAN has been removed from the ASIN, so should work to make a new listing (it did not).
• Told that an EAN cannot be re-assigned, tough. I asked if they lied before or are lying now.
• Now told the ASIN can be deleted, and that will fix, but I have to re-make the listing and then do some spreadsheet update to delete the ASIN. That is going to be fun, and no clue if it will fix.

In my view this should be simple - we prove we hold the GS1 allocation (easy), we state the (unused) ASIN+EAN is no longer valid - Amazon delete it (or remove EAN) - we make a new listing.

To be clear, if they had a system that an EAN was always stuck to a description, and were actually consistent in that, and GS1 agreed (which they sort of do), then that would be annoying but not as bad as this - they keep giving hope it can be (or even, has been) fixed, and then changing their damn mind.

But no, Amazon seller support is, without fail, a battle at every step of the way, every fucking time.

Update

I have someone with windows and Excel to try this... They made the file to upload. Thanks. But...

• They say "Create listings with a spreadsheet in any format - Al will convert it for you." Nice.
• They say "Accepted file formats: Excel, TSV" nice
• I load an excel file and they say "File Type: Inventory Loader File (Automatically detected)"
• They then say "Please upload a tab-delimited text file (file format txt or .tsv).  This feed does not support the type of file you uploaded. If you're using Excel, please convert it to a tab-separate file by following these instructions."

So yes, upload any file AI will sort, or upload excel file, and we recognise you uploaded an excel file that is an inventory loader file, but a final FUCK YOU you have to load text or TSV.

I mean what that actual fuck. We loaded a TSV, it may have worked, watch this space!

Update:

Did not work - zapped the listing but left the same problem, so I have scrapped the labels, and allocated a new GTIN/EAN.

Except that does not work - new unhelpful error at the last stage, no reference to any existing ASIN, no mention of an existing description, just "does not match the product you are trying to list". I tried loads of EANs and no joy.

WTF Amazon!

Update:

They want a video call to prove my ID (I have had to do ID for Amazon many times, so why?) and to see 50 of each product, and open and show brand on them. I don't have 50 of each product here. They are mental!

Trying out Amazon...

As you probably know, at A&A, we sell mostly things like broadband and telecoms as services, but there are a number of things that are just stock items that we sell (everything from routers, splitters, cuddly dragons to ISP grade Firebrick costing tens of thousands). So we thought it may be an idea to try out Amazon and see how it works as some things may be better and more convenient sold through Amazon.

Time consuming and tedious at first

To start with, it was quite time consuming and tedious to set up the seller account. They don't just want company details, but also passport numbers and expiries of all beneficial owners of the company, scans of passport, scans of bank statement to prove account number, credit card number, the works. It probably took me a couple of hours to sort that all.

Listing a product

Listing a product is not too hard. It involved a title, description, images, and so on. It was not entirely clear what each field did in terms of the listing, but easy to play around and learn how it goes.

As an experiment we decided to list something simple to start with, as this is a bit of a test to see how well it all works. Some playing cards (please buy some). These are actually the ones from my previous blog post, which A&A are selling now.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/RevK-19th-Century-Goodall-Reproduction/dp/B078PJCJMB

Of course anyone that got them free from me are welcome to leave an Amazon review - the funnier the better.

Fulfilled by Amazon

One of the things we wanted to experiment with is the whole "fulfilled by Amazon" thing, where they hold the stock for you. Now this has costs, related to the volume of the item, so playing cards are a good test for this. I suspect cuddly dragons are not so good.

To my surprise that was easy. I had to update the listing with weight, and dimensions. I had to advise the overall weight and dimensions for the box of 50 packs we are sending. It ended up with a shipping label to print. UPS collected later that day. 24 hours later, Amazon are selling!

It is meant to shows as Amazon Prime as well, not sure if I have missed something or being impatient on that one. It could also be I set the price a tad too low to make sense for 1-click and prime. I'll see if I can work that one out. I can see Amazon Prime being useful for things like DSL routers and splitters and so on. [update: increasing price by 99p means it is now 1-click and prime, but I could not find the help to tell me what the price has to be for this.]

The hard part - barcodes!

It turns out product barcodes are a bit of a complicated area!

There is a group (GS-1) that manages product bar codes world wide. Wikipedia explains it a bit.

It seems that, until 2002, you could buy a block of barcodes and they were yours forever and nothing prohibited you from reselling them to others. This is the sort of model I like for such things personally. There are some rules or guidelines on things like barcode reuse after a product is discontinued, but it is all pretty simple.

However, these days, you have to be a member of GS-1, on an ongoing basis, and so you effectively rent the barcodes.

However, if you google, you will see that loads of people sell barcodes, outright, for quite reasonable prices. So I bought some. Simples.

Is this legit? Well yes, from what I can tell, as these pre-2002 barcodes could be sold and re-used, so that is all that is happening.

However, it seems Amazon have a bit of an issue. They use barcodes, these UPC and EAN unique barcodes, to track stock. Indeed, if a barcode is issued to a product they will treat all stock of that product the same and interchangeable. When you create a listing you, ideally, need to give them the UPC or EAN barcode number. (There are other ways with labels on the product with Amazon issued codes).

So why is that an issue. Well, the problem is that you can just make these up. Amazon seem to accept any barcode they don't yet have in inventory. So even if you have barcodes, you can find some Chinese company has effectively hijacked them and so you cannot list your items on Amazon. Apparently Amazon can fix this, but apparently it is a hell of a lot of work.

It also turns out that it does not matter if you got barcodes directly from GS-1 or from some reseller. Indeed, it seems, the resellers check on Amazon first to eliminate any that have been hijacked. I do not know if GS-1 do the same.

As it happens, having bought 100 barcodes in March, most are now magically allocated to clothing or iPhone cases on Amazon! I did not realise this at first, as my listing for the above pack of cards using a barcode printed on the pack, works. But there was a slight clue - the control pages for setting up the listing showed this image...

That is, perhaps, a clue that someone had tried to do a listing using that code (for a dress?).

Now I come to trying to list the A&A decks of cards I find the code is not available as it is an iPhone case! This is a tad infuriating as we printed the barcode we allocated on the box! Not being listed on GS-1 as the owner, I cannot even go through the apparently time consuming process of disputing with Amazon, I don't think.

My only choice will be another barcode, and stickers on the packs (or, Amazon can do labels that go on the product for you, which would be a shame on my nicely designed boxes). I think I would rather do the stickers myself...

So what can be done?

Well, Amazon have a solution, it seems. They plan to only accept UPC/EAN codes where the manufacturer matches what GS-1 have listed. This means, apparently, these older re-sold barcodes won't work. What is odd is that, just yesterday, one did work, one we got.

If Amazon do actually go through with this new policy, even if just for new listings, that should stop the hijacked barcodes happening. However, it will mean we have to join the club and pay the ongoing fees to have directly GS-1 allocated codes, which is a shame. What we hope is that existing, legitimate, re-sold barcodes are not suspended on the Amazon site, which may possibly happen one day I guess. At this point that only impacts selling some playing cards for a bit of fun, which is why I am glad we did an experiment on this.

Even so, I can see people selling stuff, using made up barcodes, simply telling Amazon the item they are selling is "manufactured by Andrews & Arnold Ltd" which they can just look up on the GS-1 web site, and Amazon would accept the listing. After all, the seller does not have to claim to be the manufacturer. It is possible Amazon would take such issues more seriously, who knows. It would also be interesting if GS-1 would handle the arguing with Amazon for us as a member given the claims GS-1 make about how much better it is getting codes from them directly.

More to learn

We have to fully understand the costs in practice, and the processes for payments, and for VAT invoicing as well. Things will be shipped without us having issued an invoice, so we are going to have to import in to our accounting system. It is exactly this sort of thing which a trial on something simple like playing cards is worth doing.

We also need to consider what sort of things will be sensible and cost effective to sell via Amazon rather than shipping ourselves. It may be that Amazon is not for us (except perhaps for playing cards), we will see.